Recording chain?

[Pete Martin]

I asked this in the recording section, so you may want to answer there.

I'd like to hear from you who record, what is the chain you like to use? I have chains I like for acoustic instruments and electric mandolin, but am wanting to start trying some steel. I'm sure it will be a good bit before I'll share it with anyone, but listening to yourself is the fastest way to improve, right?


Thanks!

Pete

[Michael Kiese]

Hey Pete,

The simplest avenue to get good results the quickest: Mic the amp, and have good preamps on your recording interface. Simple. Even if you used an SM57 to mic the amp, it should produce acceptable results. It'll sound better if you had excellent mics and excellent preamps on your console.

I've always found that the better the mic and console you have, the better the result where live or in studio. Great gear makes it A LOT easier to achieve a pleasing sound.

You CAN go direct to the board with Steel, but I would only recommend that if you have a very high end board, with excellent high-end preamps.

Uncle Bobby has done a lot of recording dates and studio albums. Some of which have won awards. I think he recently got a Grammy for something. He told me that he always records his steel direct to the board. As evidenced by the amazing sound on his recordings, going direct also works.

If memory serves me correct, when he goes direct to the recording console, he'll play in the console room and listen through the studio monitors. That way he hears the exact same thing the Recording Engineer hears. He always politely insists on personally EQ'ing his steel channel at the board because "Engineers don't know how to EQ steel. They think they know, but they don't. They're not steel players. No one knows your sound better than you. Never let someone else control your sound, because that's you on that recording, and it's going to last forever. Make sure you get the sound you want on the recording."

He said out of all the many records that he recorded on, only ONE recording engineer knew how to get his steel sound. That was the only guy Uncle Bobby would trust.

That's probably great advice because Country steel players have a much different tone than Hawaiian Steel players. You wouldn't want someone with an ear for country steel to EQ Hawaiian steel. It'll be like an Italian putting their spin on Chinese food or vice versa. In the end, they're both noodles. But they're also different.

Just thought I'd pass that on.

All that said, do it any which way you can, and if it sounds good to you, then it's good. Don't overthink it. Keep it simple and use good gear.

Enjoy!

[Pete Martin]

Thanks as always Mike!

Anyone else???

[Mike Neer]

I almost always use a mic'd amp when I record, and I say "almost" because I have also used VST3 amps by Neural DSP and more recently the Tonex pedal. In that case, I use the same Audient interface that I use with my mics, which has very nice pres, but instead go in the Direct Inject input. It's all a matter of trial and error and the process of trying best to capture what I want from my sound. I think the most important thing is knowing how you want it to sound and finding ways to get there. I find that speakers are the most significant contributor to the sound. I like JBLs and especially Altecs, but the Roland JC amp speakers also work for me. The only issue with recording the JC is the hiss.

As far as mics, an AKG 414 captures the moving air pretty well, a Beyerdynamic M160 is a great ribbon mic, and of course the SM57. I have a few other AKG mics but mostly I use the above--or used, since I sold the M160. I also like to use a Cloudlifter with my dynamic mics for a little more umph.

Once I get the signal in my DAW, I have a lot of great plugins for really finetuning the sound, including all the FabFilter plugins, which are really great, as well as the Arouser, which is Empirical Labs' VST for the Distressor. I have a few other secret weapons too, like Modnetic, which is really great for emulating old tape delays. I could go on and on, but most important is knowing what you want and how to capture it barebones.

[Pete Martin]

Thank you so much Mike N, I very much appreciate every thing you do and especially your sound!

Another question, has anyone used a Sarno V8 going direct on non pedal steel? I see a lot of pedal players using it when searching the forum, but not any non pedal players. I’m very tempted to get one.

[Daniel Baston]

You may already know this, but mic placement is even more important than mic choice. Close micing straight on the speaker works well, but it can sound a little one-dimensional. Especially if steel is going to be featured in the recording (playing the melody etc). I would suggest having fun trying different (or even wacky) mic positions, around different spots on the amp and in the room. Sometimes moving the mic further away can intially be a bit off-putting because it sounds 'quieter'. But once you turn up (on your mic preamp) to compensate it can sometimes sound great (or you may discover that it is lousy after all, it's all an experiment). Apologies if you already know this stuff, just a thought .

[Michael Kiese]

Just wanted to tag on to Daniel's comment: if you ever try using 2 or more mics to mic the same source, and you intend to blend both mic signals, be aware of the 3:1 rule.

I agree with Daniel in that experimentation with mic placement and just trying different things is probably the best way to get a better or different sound with the gear you have. Sometimes you find really happy accidents. Using a really expensive high quality microphone always makes the process much easier. That said, you can still get good results with off the shelf gear.

Bottomline is that if it sounds good, it sounds good. Don't question it.

That said, experimentation can indeed go off the rails. So if you're using multiple mics to record the same source, be aware of the 3:1 rule to avoid phase cancellation and natural comb filtering problems. If you've ever mic'd a drumset with overhead mics, you've run into this headache.

The 3:1 rule simply states that the 2nd mic should be no closer than 3 times the distance of the first mic. For example, you mic an amp and put it 1 foot away from the speaker, the second mic should be no closer than 3 feet away. Without getting too complicated, it has to do with the possibility of the polarities of the 2 different mics being out of phase with each other, and they can cancel each other's signals out if placed too close to one another. Another possible issue is that as the soundwaves travel through the air, ideally the mics would be physically placed such that they pick up the soundwave at the same point of the crest or trough. That's more of an issue with low frequencies.

But all that geeky nerdy stuff aside, the bottomline is that nothing beats just trying things out. If it sounds good, then it sounds good. And if it sounds bad, it sounds bad. No explanation is needed in either case. lol.

But if you DO ever experience problems, knowing that the 3:1 rule exists can be helpful to troubleshoot tinny sound.

Enjoy!